Melbourne Rebels' Cooper Vuna, NSW Waratahs' Sitaleki Timani called into Tonga's Worl

After an impressive start with new Super Rugby club Melbourne Rebels, Cooper Vuna has earned a call-up into Tonga’s 50-man squad for the 2011 Rugby World Cup.

Vuna, who has proven himself in a number of positions, is joined in the extended Tongan squad by New South Wales Waratahs second-rower Sitaleki Timani.

Coach Isitolo Maka named the squad, which will be cut to 30 later in the season.

Before the squad is finalised for the September World Cup Maka must also select teams for the Churchill Cup and Pacific Nations Cup.

Vuna, who played several seasons in the NRL, and Timani, will join a squad composed of a number players who play their club rugby in New Zealand, England, Ireland and France.

Tonga’s first match of the World Cup is the tournament opener against New Zealand in Auckland on September 9.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/me...-1226043051782

Now here is some technical shit for JO'N to get his mega leadership around.
If either player debuts for Tonga then surely they will have to move onto a marquee contract, given they will no longer be eligible for the Wallabies, therefore no longer fitting the domestic criteria.

Sitaleki has already signed a contract in Japan for next year, pretty straightforward there.

Cooper Vuna is contractually bound by the ARU, they will need to give him permission to play for Tonga which will result in him either getting his contract cut or moving him onto a marquee contract.

god, i would hate to see anyone stopped from playing international rugby... just is not right...

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Originally Posted by palitu

god, i would hate to see anyone stopped from playing international rugby... just is not right...

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Said it in another thread but this one is more on topic, if hardly a new one.

Imagine what a great career Radike Samo, and many like him, could have had for Fiji if the PI players were allowed to return to play for their country of origin. Seems counterproductive for players to be warehoused/ discarded by 1st tier nations and then isolated from international duties.

Going to a hardline return on investment, if the ARU are investing in developing a player then arguably they should have first crack at getting a return, assuming eligibility, or at least be recognised in some manner for that development.

I would be in favour of development positions from & for each of the PI's at each of the Australian teams, but while the ARU is crying poor I don't think we can be raising other nations players.

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Originally Posted by Burgs

Going to a hardline return on investment, if the ARU are investing in developing a player then arguably they should have first crack at getting a return, assuming eligibility, or at least be recognised in some manner for that development.

I would be in favour of development positions from & for each of the PI's at each of the Australian teams, but while the ARU is crying poor I don't think we can be raising other nations players.

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You might not be happy that the Force are agitating for all non-Melbourne teams to get an extra marquee spot and an extra development spot then.

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Originally Posted by Burgs

Going to a hardline return on investment, if the ARU are investing in developing a player then arguably they should have first crack at getting a return, assuming eligibility, or at least be recognised in some manner for that development.

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I don't think anyone would argue that and it's not what I'm referring to. Samo was forced to make the choice in 2004 by Eddie Jones and played 6 Tests. Australian Rugby got that plus a long career at ACT from the big fella. But should such a good player have never been available to Fiji in the 8 years since? Not to my way of thinking, remembering that Fiji contributed to some of that development in that he played age group internationals for them. He's the archetypal promising Island player snatched by a 1st tier country and then discarded/lost form/whatever after relatively few Tests and never getting to play in a RWC (I suppose I should add....) - yet.

Wharehousing to me implies doing it deliberately so they won't play for a 2nd Tier (obviously happens with the likes of JO'C with competing 1st Tier potential) nation.
It is an IRB ruling that 1st Tier work to, not vv.
I would be delighted if the ruling was 2nd Tier for life or if 1st Tier capped then after "x" (three years inactive, or 1st T releases or whatever) then can represent 2nd Tier, but that isn't an option without IRB intervention.

Beige, I wouldn't have a problem with that at all, so long as it is recognised as an investment in the region and not an expectation. I would though certainly prefer if it had to be a player from PI's, Argentina or Japan. I think it is ultimately counterproductive (short term band aid v long term development) to parachute 1st Tier marquee's in.

add- I think the key word you used though Shasta is Samo had the "choice", the only forcing was the timeline to decide as back then to even be playing SR he had to be Wallaby eligible to get a contract. If he said no, I want to play for Fiji, then he would have had to end his provincial career in the SH but would still have been able to play pro Rugby.

I agree, it is sad that it doesn't happen, but that is an IRB failing more than an ARU/SANZAR fault.

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Originally Posted by Burgs

I would though certainly prefer if it had to be a player from PI's, Argentina or Japan. I think it is ultimately counterproductive (short term band aid v long term development) to parachute 1st Tier marquee's in.

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Agreed although I would expand that to any developing country in the region. However, I wouldn't like to see it mandated - if a big NH star wanted to come down and a team had a need for him I wouldn't necessarily see it as a bad thing.

Perhaps some kind of partnership with these developing unions might be better, where one or two internationals could be sent to train with a Super Rugby squad with a view to getting a full contract (similar to Kousuke Endo a few years back when he unsuccessfully tried to crack the Crusaders squad). I'm really just vomiting text though because I don't think it will happen.

I've always said that the way to smooth out the international player problems is to open up a development slot or two for players playing for either PI Japan or Argentina, that's not so much Australia paying for their development as it is the provinces getting a good return (international standard player) for their investment (development funds) without snagging the home nation of that player.

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Originally Posted by Burgs

add- I think the key word you used though Shasta is Samo had the "choice", the only forcing was the timeline to decide as back then to even be playing SR he had to be Wallaby eligible to get a contract.

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Perhaps the words forced and warehousing might be a bit too strong. But all a player had to do to for a SR contract is be eligible - not declare an allegiance. I know that Willie Ripia had to and maybe Fairbrother but I don't think Oz based players were asked to as a matter of process. I remember feeling uncomfortable about the way things were handled at the time and that I thought Jones was forcing his hand at the time when he didn't really need to. Unless I'm remembering the events wrongly I think Samo was asked to declare an allegiance before being picked in the Wallaby squad. That's a hiding to nothing (even though he was actually selected).

Of course it could be that I'm just on old fart with a failing memory. :S

Or I just didn't like Eddy Jones - that hasn't changed at least.

I don't blame ARU/SANZAR at all. In fact I almost added that the IRB should get their heads out of their arses on the issue in the original post. .

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Originally Posted by shasta

Or I just didn't like Eddy Jones - that hasn't changed at least.

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Wouldn't that make you a good judge of character?

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Originally Posted by GIGS20

Wouldn't that make you a good judge of character?

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Either that or there's a helluva lot of poor judges out there besides me. :)