Round 14 - Some big games here

[RumourMonger]

From what you were saying before you know who was involved in the Foreshore, Does that mean you think Sprog & that person are the same?

Will you be at Paly to watch the game on Sat?

Have no idea who Sprog is but he and you are often on twf batting for the referees (hope its not for the other side as well!) and he's been quiet all week. My suspicious mind thought he must have been shamed into silence. Then again, he may be away on holidays.

The clubs are informed who is to ref their games each week. The word is out.

Most likely Lark Hill on Saturday.

[Sprogrugby]

There is no doubt that a ref can indirectly and directly influence the tempers within the game, for good or bad. It is rather too simplistic to simply and always say 'but it's the player that chooses to punch' for this very reason, but ultimately a ref needs to act on what he sees.

Confidence in the ability of your ARs is important, which may sometimes lead me as a ref to place a 'context' on what an AR tells me together with my own interpretation. Sorry rugby followers but you also have to deal with the fact AR ability varies as with refs, players, coaches etc.

Some ref peers will believe that issuing cards early and at the first sign of trouble will minimize any such issues. To not do this obviously runs the risk that if it explodes it does so hugely. The advantage (when it works) of working with players to give them the benefit is that we have 15 against 15 for as long as possible.

Without review of the specific games it is not possible to provide my ref peer opinion (for what it's worth) on how the issues were handled (I did see the clip and was impressed with RugbyRef's dealing with the specific issue when it happened. I didn't see anything of Neds v Rocky).

From what I've read, some Twf'ers are referring more to the issues leading up to the Neds v Rocky blow up (quoting Hansie that there had been 50 mins of good rugby to that point). I can't comment not having seen it.

Ideally, if there are trends with a given ref and the number of cards issued on average across games, then I'd like to think the selectors recognise this and either review game extracts, appoint ref coaches for a couple of games to that ref, and or appoint to certain games that will either 'test' the theory under observation, or alternatively steer them away from potential flash points until such time as further coaching provides answers.

Sometimes the ref is irrelevant, and it is only the extent or timing of sanction that will change. I've done Rocky once this year, have only issued 1 YC this season and it was against them, after ~ 20 mins for foul play. Having issued it, everything calmed and they went on to produce a great performance.

Sometimes it is just the way the game unfolds, the sort of day the ref and players are having. I'm not a politician, I just am against immediate judgement in the absence of all of the facts.
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[RugbyRef]

Most likely Lark Hill on Saturday.

Going to buy me a drink this time then?

[brokendown gunfighter]

You should know not to spread rumours Hansie!

Despite the brawls and chaos, believe me I am the last person you want out there. Half of Nedlands' players would be suspended if had a whistle and some red cards at my disposal. Then again, half of them might be after Wednesday nights judiciary!


Where's Sproggy? He's been suspiciously quiet. Was he involved in either the Battle of Hartfield or the Foreshore Offensive?

RM,if you were at the Foreshore on Saturday.you would have known that only one Nedlands player was red carded---So I take it that you weren't there?

[RumourMonger]

I was otherwise engaged last Saturday.

Am trying to put the pieces of the jig saw together from what I've heard and from what has been posted. Not a clear picture.

What's your opinion BDG? Did the ref screw up or the players?

A number of posters have suggested that some Neddies players should be cited and I (rightly or wrongly) assumed that this would occur.

[RumourMonger]

Going to buy me a drink this time then?

If I hang around with you I'm likely to get involved in a punch up! You've started a few lately so I'm informed.

[brokendown gunfighter]

possibly---I only arrived after halftime(didn't know the KO was early),so the spotfires had already ignited---wasn't pleasant viewing,that's for sure

[stadh]

possibly---I only arrived after halftime(didn't know the KO was early),so the spotfires had already ignited---wasn't pleasant viewing,that's for sure

i was there and yes the ref might of contributed but when the rocky number 18 punched the neddies 7 from behind and then the rocky 10th kicked the same player in the head the blame falls at the feet of those gutless grubs from rocky.nothing else would of happened .its a pattern of this club with cheap shots that resulted in a brawl at cott last year or is it everyones picking on rocky.
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[brokendown gunfighter]

maybe RM was suggesting the the Neddies player should be cited for a cowardly heat butt to the rockys player's foot

[Pacman]

What did Rockys ex Force player get red carded for?
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[RumourMonger]

Can someone with access to the DVD put a link to the part of the game in question on twf?

That might clarify matters.

Who was the Neddies guy who ran on and joined the brawl?

[The Bear]

Everyone seems keen to see what happened in between what sounds like patches of good rugby.
The unfortunate side to this is that mums of young males will hear about it and along with with watching Wallabies (and Madness) carted of on stretchers will try to persuade their sons that this is not a great game for them to play. Famous punchup and brawls are part of Rugby folklore to the older genaration of players and if involved it was often with a tinge of regret afterwards. Today the public and mums in particular are more perceptive to what happens out there. 30 guys on the field, 14 reserves and 2 coaches in most grades should be aware that they have an obligation to play the game with greater self control rather than rely on one referee trying to manage them. Lack of under 18's and 20's iand player retention in our competition is an ongoing issue. This could be a clue!!

[The Bear]

Apologies Westie, it should read "and player retention" rather than "iand"

[NTT]

One issue that is evident but hasn't been mentioned is player behaviour. Sledging, cheap shots and niggly crap are behaviours that have risen to an unacceptable level. Fights erupt because players are too easily goaded into such behaviour. Players and Coaches need to accept responsibility for their conduct and be willing to change for the better. Players need to develop greater mental resolve to be able to focus on playing good rugby and leave the bullshit to the side. Coaches need to enforce codes of conduct for their players. Trying to blame a 3rd party for this behaviour is like blaming the plumber that your car won't start. It does not matter who the ref was, who the AR's were or who ran the coffee stall, the responsibility lies with the coaches and players to improve their own behaviour. I personally believe this issue of player behaviour needs to be addressed quickly before something really nasty happens. The situation is at tipping point.

[Sprogrugby]

Good point NTT. For fear of sounding like an old fart and sometimes the boys laughing at / with me, I try to get them to stop any of that crap if I hear it. I think it will always help (it can't hurt) if we can remove that from players' focus.