Terms of Reference for a Senate Inquiry into the Future of Rugby Union in Australia

[Bakkies]

Plus 500 are major sponsor for Atletico Madrid so they have a record of sponsorship that Firepower didn't have (besides the Force and Souths who else did they sponsor) and the Israelis are pretty shrewd businessmen. Rogue player agents aren't providing third party sponsorship deals which was one of the biggest issues with Firepower.

A lot of the stuff they were fined for in the UK is what businesses used to get away with under new Labour who didn't really enforce regulations. That's one of the reasons why the UK was massively hit by the GFC.

Brumbies profit is only small due to previous CEO taking the team to court, ARU under funding (which is why the ACT Gov't contribute) and the uncertainty which was caused by ARU mismanagement didn't help either. Season tickets are capped around 10,000 or so due to the stadium capacity so it is money in the bank and sponsorship has been full for a while.

[sittingbison]

Sydney Kings....

[boof1050]

A V8 racing team as well.

[Bakkies]

Two horse Taxi Racing between Holden and Ford and a declining Basketball competition enough said. Providing large sums of money towards third party agreements in a Rugby competition where there is more competition in Rugby and League for that matter for players is a completely different kettle of fish. They were affecting running of clubs and their business dealings rather than just sponsoring the team.

There was no salary cap back then in Rugby so agents and teams were trying to use third party deals to top up contracts. Teams were offering favours for players to do a bit of work outside of the game at their third parties. In League the salary cap was being exploited and there were suggestions that Storm players were being offered boats and other luxuries to stay at the club. That all stopped when O'Neill introduced the salary cap in Rugby and limited third party deals and Wallaby top ups. In regards to League clubs were punished severely for breaching the salary cap (particularly the Bulldogs and Storm) and the Storm started using results, culture and performance program to attract players was the best thing they ever did.

I remember when Clyde Rathbone was shopped around the country and there were all sorts of rumours about him joining the Tahs or the Force due to lifestyle and more money on offer. There was a lot of disbelief when he turned down both offers to stay at the Brumbies. A lot of people outside of Canberra tipped the Brumbies to fall as the other teams could offer a so called better lifestyle and financial package. In reality it was between the Force and Waratahs. Either side had limited squad spaces and the Reds were a basket case so what sponsors would attract players to throw away their careers there. Didn't stop the Waratahs from hoarding players, Sydney Uni had Super Rugby players playing in their second grade due to their 'depth' and the Sydney clubs did their utmost at convincing players not to sign with the Force even though it was a pretty good career option. The Force were moving up the table and had potential to compete for the Finals.

The Brumbies still quietly went about winning Rugby games and players signed to play there. Helped by the mess that the Reds were in with Moore, Chapman, Wallace Harrison and Dan Heenan moving to Canberra.

[sittingbison]

...There was no salary cap back then in Rugby so agents and teams were trying to use third party deals to top up contracts. Teams were offering favours for players to do a bit of work outside of the game at their third parties...

Didn't stop the ARU from PUBLICLY executing the Force with Kanaargate then Firepower

All you said is true Bakkies. Firepower did effect a lot of people in a lot of sports though.

[Bakkies]

Didn't stop the ARU from PUBLICLY executing the Force with Kanaargate then Firepower

All you said is true Bakkies. Firepower did effect a lot of people in a lot of sports though.

and Kanaar retired not long after due to injury. The Force dodged a bullet there.

Firepower is another Imperium a business launched on a pie in the sky business idea.

The Rebels may not escape from this. There is no guarantee that a future incarnation of the ARU won't bring them to task and of course the Senate report and recommendations haven't been released.

If the Libs win the Vic election there is also no guarantee that the undisclosed deal with the Rebels will stay. Just look at what Rudd did with the Ballymore redevelopment plan that was approved by the previous Howard Government.

[BLR]

Jeez, sorry to bring up Firepower.

All I mean is I believe Plus500's business practices leave alot to be desired and despite their public image being quite prominent it would only take a few journalists to do some digging to take some of the shine off it.

Multiple sponsorships don't make right.

[Bakkies]

Looks like TWAS has another paid shill supporting him on the Roar.

[Kalahard]

11 days and counting ....

[SPaRTAN]

I think RugbyWA should publicly announce that if The ARU dont approve the IPRC by COB WA standard time then rugbyWA will make an official announcement to secede from the ARU/RA.

I fail to see any benefit by being apart of the ARU/RA and I reckon WA rugby would prosper moving forward. The only thing that would happen would be that players would no longer be eligable for Wallaby selection. Big deal, who cares!

Secede is the only practical way forward. Then WA can be a national team and join the rugby championship one day and have an equal share in SANZAARWA. That means regular games against the All Blacks/ Wallabies /boks and Argentineans. Sounds logical.

[Bakkies]

I think RugbyWA should publicly announce that if The ARU dont approve the IPRC by COB WA standard time then rugbyWA will make an official announcement to secede from the ARU/RA.

I fail to see any benefit by being apart of the ARU/RA and I reckon WA rugby would prosper moving forward. The only thing that would happen would be that players would no longer be eligable for Wallaby selection. Big deal, who cares!

Secede is the only practical way forward. Then WA can be a national team and join the rugby championship one day and have an equal share in SANZAARWA. That means regular games against the All Blacks/ Wallabies /boks and Argentineans. Sounds logical.

Hansie said a while back that succeeding is a possibility but didn't go in to further detail which I can understand due to the negotiations with the ARU and IRB. There are some details that need to be clarified in regards to that:
- Getting IRB recognition which is important to getting test status. I understand that having a league competition is one part of achieving test status
- Rugby World Cup, Womens RWC and JWC qualification, which confederation do WA go in to?
- WA qualified players like Rona and Hardwick who have Wallaby caps. Would they be allowed to play for WA or will they be cap tied to Australia?
- Olympic qualification as WA is still a part of the AOC, will future WA capped players be able to represent Australia in the Olympics despite being cap tied by another union?
- WADA compliance

I see the odd sweeping statement is still prevalent on G and G.

[GIGS20]

I fail to see any benefit by being apart of the ARU/RA and I reckon WA rugby would prosper moving forward. The only thing that would happen would be that players would no longer be eligable for Wallaby selection. Big deal, who cares!

Looking in my crystal ball, I can see that WA players won't really be eligible for Wallaby selection in three years anyway.

ESRU (or REA) appear to be stalling Twiggy at every turn, refusing to accept Wallaby selection for anybody who doesn't want to move to Sydney before their 17th birthday, so where's the issue.

Then WA can be a national team and join the rugby championship one day and have an equal share in SANZAARWA. That means regular games against the All Blacks/ Wallabies /boks and Argentineans. Sounds logical.

OK Firstly, eewwww, I wouldn't want Hansie and John messing around in that cesspool, they might catch something and bring it back to WA. Secondly, it would have to be SANZWAAAR wouldn't it? or, more likely (by the time they bend enough to actually admit us WASANZAaR but I seriously don't think it would happen in my lifetime, I mean look at how resistant they are at the prospect of having a Pacific Islands team, they don't want anything standing in the way of them raping Fiji and Samoa of their best talent to "earn" national selection by playing a few years in Canberra or Auckland.

[jono]

RWA aren’t going to secede.

[Bakkies]

Just raised on G and G that the Sydney press still haven't jumped on the Reds financial and structural mismanagement. They are really afraid to lose their press badges. They don't have any issue in regards to kicking the Force and/or the Brumbies if something goes wrong with those two teams.

[shasta]

RWA aren’t going to secede.

And who would want them to? Dunno about any one else; but I'm an Australian and want to be a Wallaby supporter again one day. End of story.
I am hoping this whole shit fight will be settled sooner than later. When Clyne and his co-conspirators are gone and looked back on as the arseholes who ALMOST killed the game. As much as I'm pissed off now, I want the bridges rebuilt one day.
Hopefully I'll live to see it.