Axe hangs over Giteau, Mitchell after latest flop

[GIGS20]

I'd replace Elsom with a big lock and shift Mumm to the 6......We do need some height in the lineout and Elsom is a waste of space ATM.

Brown's fine, unless you want to replace him with Hoiles (LOL) I personally think he's a better option than Palu, because he doesn't go missing when the pressure's on. We could always give Matty H a go at the 8, cos he's a rat hard bastard who'll beat the shit out of anybody who gets near his football!

This is all assuming Sharpie's playing for the rest of the next two years.

[zimeric]

Brownie, Hodgo & Pocock .. the three flesh eating trolls of Aussie Rugby...

[MI5_Dog]

Brownie was all over the place in the Ireland match! Between him and Pohey they had almost every ruck and maul covered. Playing against the Boks and Kiwis the breakdown is going to be where games are won and lost.

[Timbo]

OK - when someone can find a clone of Spies to drop into 8, I will wear that - but until then I would prefer the rock-hard mongrel of a lighter Hodgo than the away in a manger nothingness of a heavier Elsom or Palu.

And while I am hoping for miracles from the selectors, Sharpie for Captain!!

[TOCC]

browny isnt a test number 8, his role in the team isnt to make it to every ruck, he is supposed to be the ball runner who gets across the advantage line. He has only achieved that 3 or 4 times in the last 3 tests.

[MI5_Dog]

Well TOCC it seems Deans may have a different idea on what he wants from a number 8

[palitu]

is it just me or are the ruck laws a lot softer in test rugby?? There are hardly ever any not releasing the ball in the last three tests. I saw one in the first AUS v ENG match....

if thats the case, having three on the ball loosies wouldn't be a great advantage as we would steal/win penalties as much...

[Sheikh]

is it just me or are the ruck laws a lot softer in test rugby?? There are hardly ever any not releasing the ball in the last three tests. I saw one in the first AUS v ENG match....

if thats the case, having three on the ball loosies wouldn't be a great advantage as we would steal/win penalties as much...

That might be the different interpretation of a NH ref. The ref for the Perth match was Welsh, and I read somewhere he did the second test, too (although the match report may have been wrong).

I think it was a mistake making Elsom captain; he'd only been an occasional captain at club level. At the time he might have been one of the first names on the team sheet, but that was when he on form. A captain should be worth his name on the team sheet even when off form.

If Elsom can be dropped then the Wallabies could put an all-Force back row together. However, the Force ended up second-last on the ladder this season, so I wouldn't blame people querying that selection.

[TOCC]

Well TOCC it seems Deans may have a different idea on what he wants from a number 8

well no, its the exact reason that Brown was second to Palu in selection all last year, and its also the reason that Hoiles is second to Brown even though Hoiles arguably had a better Super15 campaign.

Whats stopping moving Elsom to 8 at the moment is the lack of another quality blinside, one option is to move mumm to blindside but the injury toll on locks at the moment means that cant be done either.

[zimeric]

well no, its the exact reason that Brown was second to Palu in selection all last year, and its also the reason that Hoiles is second to Brown even though Hoiles arguably had a better Super15 campaign.

Whats stopping moving Elsom to 8 at the moment is the lack of another quality blinside, one option is to move mumm to blindside but the injury toll on locks at the moment means that cant be done either.

disagree.... Brown was dropped due to a shocker under the high ball... the Lack of another quality blindside?? Hodgson has more than proved his credentials there...

I do however agree that Palu is a better option against 10man NH teams... in the tri-nations Brownie will be my pick with either Elsom or Hodgo on the blind and Pocock on openside.

[TOCC]

hodgson plays like a openside, you cant play two lightweight opensides at test level. Eddie Jones tried it with Waugh and Smith, not only that it severly undermines the scrum by not having a big blindside flanker to support the prop, one of the reasons australias scrum was so shit during the eddie jones era.

Ben McCalman is more likely to get a call up to partner Brown and Pocock then Hodgson is.

Ben McCalman, Scott Higginbotham, Locky McCaffrey and Rocky Elsom are your blindside flanker moulds

[zimeric]

I understand your point but i dont neccessarily agree with it. Hodgo wouldnt be on the bench if he couldnt play all three backrow spots.. if Deans wanted a big Blindside then he'd want them to cover 6 & 8... wheres Higgenbotham??? everyone was tipping him to be in the squad.

The only reason Elsom is still in the squad is that he is purported to be a ball carrier, but im yet to see much of that..(he did do a little in the last game to his credit but he was often too close to the scrum to make any impact)

[Hoolly Doolly]

disagree.... Brown was dropped due to a shocker under the high ball... the Lack of another quality blindside?? .

More so for poor discipline copping yellow cards, and probably costing the aussies a couple games.

[TOCC]

I understand your point but i dont neccessarily agree with it. Hodgo wouldnt be on the bench if he couldnt play all three backrow spots.. if Deans wanted a big Blindside then he'd want them to cover 6 & 8... wheres Higgenbotham??? everyone was tipping him to be in the squad.

The only reason Elsom is still in the squad is that he is purported to be a ball carrier, but im yet to see much of that..(he did do a little in the last game to his credit but he was often too close to the scrum to make any impact)

Higginbotham is injured, did his ankle in the last game against the highlanders..

Hodgo doesnt need to cover all the bench spots, in the event that Elsom or Brown are injured, its more likely you will see the reserve lock come on and have Mumm move to blindside replacing Elsom who is either injured or moves to number 8.

Alternatively, if its later in the game(last 20min), the you could bring Hodgo on in replacement of Brown or Elsom because the game style has changed slightly by that point with everyone been fatigued slightly.

[GIGS20]

Higginbotham is injured, did his ankle in the last game against the highlanders..

Hodgo doesnt need to cover all the bench spots, in the event that Elsom or Brown are injured, its more likely you will see the reserve lock come on and have Mumm move to blindside replacing Elsom who is either injured or moves to number 8.

Alternatively, if its later in the game(last 20min), the you could bring Hodgo on in replacement of Brown or Elsom because the game style has changed slightly by that point with everyone been fatigued slightly.

Or you could follow the philosophy of waht has been touted as one of the most impressive back rows in Aussie Rugby, arguably the comp by playing three opensides.

It has been effective at super 14 level, shutting down the Tahs, the Bulls, the Stormers and the 'Saders. Now I'm not sure, but I think those four teams contain pretty much all of the possible contenders for backrowers in the Trinations and the three blokes we're talking about have dispatched all of them.

(and before you point to scorelines, telling me we didn't win all of the games, I will simply rebut by asking you to look at footage of the breakdown in those matches, we got plenty of go forward, and raped with turnover ball!

You might think that a big #8 is vital, but it has already been proven that multiple fetchers can also work in the modern game, where everybody is expected to be either a ball carrier or a ball player (sometimes both)