Force v Hurricanes Sat 3rd JUNE 2017 7.55pm

[sittingbison]

Agree with many comments... so proud of the boys and Blood, they have it a red hot go, pining the canes on their try line for swathes...only Desperate defence and Hoff held them out - incessant cheating not duly punished. At one point in 2nd half FOUR penalties and THREE scrum resets inside 5m line!! FurtherTessman scored, as did Grant, both TMO "decisions" a farce. And yellow? Nuff said. Despite getting shafted they kept at it, immense. Those tries after the yellow were expected, and pleased tgey came storming back for the last try, guts and determination.
Sure they could have kicked ten penalties, but they showed intent instead, its what stuck it up the canes and hoff for so long.
Sure they could have gone wide when the pick and drive failed. But they kept it tight.
I think this was one of their best ever performances, they woz robbed - maybe not of a win but of a true reflection of the game.

BTW I loved how hoff tried to even things up with a yellow at 78mins and a couple of soft penalties. Dickhead.

[SinBin]

Great game by the boys. I'm not going to criticise Hoff but it would've interesting to see a northern hemisphere ref adjudicating last night. Many control the set piece better eg, top French ref. But, they can be pedantic and not let the game flow so it's a trade off.. It's no wonder the kiwis moan like hell when they've got a northern ref as they can't get away with as much..

[shasta]

Agree with many comments...

Yes. I was happy to see the Canes pinned inside their half for so long. Take 3 points and you are back in your own half with a 50/50 chance of keeping possession and the Canes are pretty handy from broken play. Better to try for 7.

Much has been made of the inability to get over the stripe but even the commentators were bemused by the offside play and illegal countering of our driving maul during that whole 1st half period. When the boys did the same at the other end it was not much better.

Having said that, we had a fair few bad decisions go our way too. That ref is just not up to the job at this level.

I was disappointed - but only a little of that by our team.

[WFDom]

Just saw this on a SR thread on FB from a Canes fan

"Probably the most dirty team in the comp and hope they get dropped. Holding players, constant cheap shots and dirty tactics. Good discipline from the Hurricanes and TJ had a man of match performance"

😳😳😳😳😳

[GIGS20]

Until the last sentence I thought he was criticising the canes.

They can't honestly believe that can they?

[Kalahard]

Good game by the boys. Good effort, had me on the edge of my seat most of the game.

Lost a great deal of respect for Perenara even before his performance. I use the sports ears to listen to the refs mic and have never heard such whinging like a spoilt brat not getting his way, just goes to show the pressure our boys were applying.

Missed out again lads, see ya 7th of July

Interesting you say that about the Kiwis badgering the refs. During the Crusaders vs Highlanders match the Kiwi commentators had a quick conversation about how much the Kiwi players whinge at the refs and whether they should reign it in a bit. They also bemoaned how much influence the TMO now has on a match.

That being said, DHPs yellow was a joke and lead directly to the 3 try burst that won the match for the Canes. The on field ref said there was nothing in it and the TMO deemed that DHP, who was merely holding his ground, had moved into Perenara with a shoulder who went flopping about like he had been shot. Same thing happened to Richie Arnold in the Highlanders game, he barely ran into Tom Banks who went down like he had been run over by an army tank, yet the whole time he is lying on the ground expecting a penalty for his acting, with a grin.
The other Kiwi tactic that has crept into the game and needs to be refereed stricter is how they use blocker runners to open gaps. Every Kiwi team has 3 or 4 forwards running in between defenders in front of their backs who have the ball. When a back gets near a tackler the forward will either run through the defensive line blocking inside defenders or suddenly stop, both actions force defenders to change their running lines which open the gaps. Same on kick returns, the Kiwis will run the ball back at a pod of players who are stationed up field in front of the kick returner. The player runs the ball back and looks to link up with these pods of players who never attempted to retreat and get onside.This is how the Chiefs manufacture most of their long range tries, they make a linebreak or a kick return and use teammates who are running "support" lines up field. Damien MacKenzie will make a kick return then pass it to Sam Cane who was put onside a mere one one hundreth of a second earlier by MacKenzie, Cane has never retreated or attempted to get onside, Cane will move across field to set up where MacKenzie should run too.
These tactics are very subtle and are usually hard for the referee to spot as the referee is mostly ball watching and not watching players in between the kicks. Also most referees are not calling the Kiwi teams out on how they use forwards to distract defensive lines by running through the line or stopping still, with both tactics forcing defenders to alter their running lines.

[travelling_gerry]

Stressed Force players told to relax


Western Force players will be given the next 10 days off before returning for a three-week training block ahead of their final two games of the season.
Source: AAP

4 JUN 2017 - 12:14 PM UPDATED 1 HOUR AGO

Western Force coach Dave Wessels hopes his players can use the Super Rugby break to escape the "emotional stress" they've been under all season.

The Force won't play again until July 7 because of the June Test window.

The extended break at the tail-end of the Super Rugby season has been heavily criticised by fans, players, and coaches alike.

Nevertheless, Wessels wants to use the break as a mental refresher - for him and his players.

The Force's future hangs in the balance, with either them or the Rebels to be axed ahead of next season.

The gravity of the situation has been weighing heavily on Force players all season, but Wessels has told his charges to try to forget about their troubles for a little bit.

Force players will get 10 days off, before returning for a three-week training block.

"The emotional stress of everybody - in some ways it's good for us to get away from that for a little bit, and spend time with our families," Wessels said.

"Just get away from rugby and try not to think about it as much as we can.

"Hopefully in that time we'll get more clarity. But I'm not really sure where that's at."

Wessels joked his first order of business would be to reintroduce himself to his wife and kids.

The Force's finals hopes are already over, and they'll play just two more games after the break - against the Rebels and Waratahs - to complete their season.

The Force were gutsy in Saturday night's 34-12 loss to the Hurricanes in Perth, dominating possession and territory for most of the match.

But the Hurricanes scored four tries within the space of 17 minutes in the second half to secure the bonus-point victory.

The Hurricanes' six tries took their season tally to 83 - eclipsing the previous record of 81 set by the Lions last year.

Force veteran Matt Hodgson will undergo scans on Tuesday after limping off with a calf injury in the first half.

Lock Adam Coleman copped a heavy head knock in the second half, but he's expected to be given the all clear to link up with the Wallabies' squad for the June Tests.

The Force have won just four of their 13 games this season.

On paper, it doesn't look pretty.

But the Perth-based franchise have been competitive in most of their losses, and they've also uncovered a host of emerging stars such as Chance Peni, Alex Newsome, Jermaine Ainsley, Billy Meakes, Richard Hardwick, and Isireli Naisarani.

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2...ers-told-relax

[shasta]

The other Kiwi tactic that has crept into the game and needs to be refereed stricter is how they use blocker runners to open gaps. Every Kiwi team has 3 or 4 forwards running in between defenders in front of their backs who have the ball. When a back gets near a tackler the forward will either run through the defensive line blocking inside defenders or suddenly stop, both actions force defenders to change their running lines which open the gaps. Same on kick returns, the Kiwis will run the ball back at a pod of players who are stationed up field in front of the kick returner. The player runs the ball back and looks to link up with these pods of players who never attempted to retreat and get onside.

Hadn't really picked up the second tactic. But have been concerned with the first for some time and mentioned it here after an earlier match. Possibly the Blues. Both are clever tactics and, the first at least, seem to be employed by all their franchises. Got to admit I'm not sure it's illegal. But would seem to be loitering in an offside position at the least.
Being also a League watcher, these block plays are nothing new and led that game to come up with a (little complicated) set of guidelines for interpretation. Even led to ex-players in the TMO box to help define obstructions. But it's still a very grey area and not as critical given the 10 meter offside line.
The Kiwi players seem very well drilled on exactly when they have distracted defenders and either pull up abruptly or to accelerate away at an angle which does not directly shepherd the ball carrier.
Will be interesting to see if this is in the AB's bag of tricks this month

[westies man]

Opposition are all cheats, all the refs are shit and hate the Force, same old crap. It was the ref's fault the scrum got destroyed because the opposition didn't give the Force the respect they deserve and were bad sports.

I'd be looking a bit more at the reasons the Force can't penetrate a good defensive structure and why they reverse to type and attempt to pick and go 400 times in a row when the holes were there out wide and a simple transfer would have seen them score tries. Not rocket science.

I really wonder how much rugby understanding some of the people on this site really have, in some cases I'd say SFA.

[Kalahard]

Regardless of my views on some of the tactics the Kiwis employ, none of which by the way are illegal under current laws, there were a few structural issues the Force were having inside the Canes 22 that stopped them scoring. The main issue the Force were having was the clean outs. The forwards would smash away at the tryline and the backs would often follow suit by using short width runners. Where this broke down for the Force was it sucked the backs into the cleanouts leaving no numbers for the next backline phase. Too often Grant and Burton were in cleaning out rucks instead of organizing the next backline play. This resulted in the Force using the one out bash at the tryline instead of trying to manufacture and exploit overlaps. Same with Meakes, it is great that he likes to get in and tackle and clean out rucks but sometimes he needs to make the tackle then look to get back out wide in defense to help out the slower players and on attack he needs to be the second playmaker in attack when we are hard on attack to give more options to get away from the one out stuff we fall back into.
That was a big factor in our inability to score tries, too often our 10 and 12 were in cleaning rucks inside the 22 instead of directing the point of attack to look for and exploit weaknesses and overlaps. The Canes defended well but really only had to make predictable tackles. The Force need to address this glaring imbalance in their attacking structure inside the opposition 22 if they are to rack up the tries. For a great example of what i am pointing out, watch the few minutes Luke Burton was on last night. Burton hit more cleanouts than he threw passes. Our backs were poorly organised in the Canes 22.

[andrewg]

No time for much else than posting the normal tables.

Agree with Kalahard re backs too involved with Rucks.
The Backs have to step up as too often our Forwards are missing from the early engagement (or any engagement at all).
Have been calling for some time for Aussie Forwards (especially the Tight 5) to step up.





Very consistent effort by Ross Haylett-Petty.

Canes defensive effort highly commendable.

There are times we should take the 3 points.
At 24 & 29 minutes. 6:7 could have changed the shape of the game.
And again at 62 mins (instead of the scum) as 10:17 ditto.

Hoffmann and Mitchelmore must be good with cats (trying to think of something nice to say!)

[travelling_gerry]

Western Force talk 'fighting spirit' after giving Hurricanes a minor scare

Justin Chadwick

Western Force coach Dave Wessels praised his team's fighting spirit after his players dominated for long periods in their 34-12 loss to the Hurricanes in Saturday night's Super Rugby clash in Perth.

A boilover was on the cards when Force fullback Dane Haylett-Petty scored a 44th-minute try to reduce the margin to just five points in front of 10,384 fans.


The Hurricanes have continued their charge to the Super Rugby finals, overcoming the Western Force 34-12 in Perth.
The Force had dominated field position and possession until that point, and it was only the Hurricanes' resolute defence that had kept the home side at bay.

But the Hurricanes ran in four tries within the space of 17 minutes in the second half to blow the game apart and secure the bonus-point win.

The result means Australian teams are now 0-23 against NZ outfits this season.

The Kiwis can make it a regular-season whitewash if the Highlanders beat the Reds in Dunedin on July 14 and the Chiefs down the Brumbies in Waikato on July 15.

"I'm very proud of the effort the boys put in," Wessels said.

"The frustrating thing was not being able to convert when we were inside their 22."

Force veteran Matt Hodgson will undergo scans after limping off in the 25th minute with a left calf injury.

Hurricanes coach Chris Boyd was disappointed with his team's effort, despite securing a valuable bonus-point win.

"You can't win games of football on 80 per cent possession and territory to the other fellas," Boyd said.

"We were lucky we got two or three quick tries from broken play to get the bonus point. But it was a long way from a complete performance."

The Force's mathematical chances of reaching the finals were extinguished before kickoff on Saturday when the Brumbies beat the Rebels 32-3 to wrap up top spot in the Australian conference.

And the Perth-based franchise was caught napping in the second minute when Hurricanes fullback Jordie Barrett made a break to set up Laumape for the opening try.

The Hurricanes are renowned for their attacking flair.

But the defending champions were on the ropes for long periods of the opening half as the Force threatened to cross time and again.

The Hurricanes seemed impenetrable at ground level, so the Force turned to the air in the 44th minute - with great effect.

Flyhalf Peter Grant unleashed a high bomb. And when three Hurricanes defenders clattered together in an attempt to mark the ball, Haylett-Petty scooped up the crumbs to touch down.

But the joy was short-lived, with the Hurricanes piling on four tries from the 55-minute mark up until the 72nd minute.

The Force dominated most of the key statistics, and Wessels questioned why the Hurricanes didn't receive a yellow card for committing a glut of penalties inside their defensive 22.

AAP


http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/un...03-gwjxfp.html

[sittingbison]

Opposition are all cheats, all the refs are shit and hate the Force, same old crap. It was the ref's fault the scrum got destroyed because the opposition didn't give the Force the respect they deserve and were bad sports.

I'd be looking a bit more at the reasons the Force can't penetrate a good defensive structure and why they reverse to type and attempt to pick and go 400 times in a row when the holes were there out wide and a simple transfer would have seen them score tries. Not rocket science.

I really wonder how much rugby understanding some of the people on this site really have, in some cases I'd say SFA.

Half right and half wrong.

Refs really were crap for both teams, and particularly biased against Force...again...surprise surprise its the Hoff, and ruined an enthralling contest

That said, yes the Force repeated the same action expecting a different result ie mad however as pointed out several times it pinned them for lengthy stretches and going wide could have exposed us to counter attacks.

The real problem with battering at canes was the lack of consistency in reffing, canes got away with repeated murder in the 5 yard zone. Perhaps recognizing this Force could have chanced their luck and changed tack...we will never know the outcome

I was happy they COULD and DID give it to tbe canes as they did instead of bending over and taking it up the khyber

[eleypinkbit]

I've never heard a TMO interfere so much with a game as last night, there were at least 3 "check, checks" where he wanted to look at something on the field that hadn't been picked up by the onfield ref. And he almost demanded Hoff change his yellow card decision on DHP as Hoff was happy initially.
Thought the TMO was there to review not to actually ref the game!

[westies man]

Half right and half wrong.

Refs really were crap for both teams, and particularly biased against Force...again...surprise surprise its the Hoff, and ruined an enthralling contest

That said, yes the Force repeated the same action expecting a different result ie mad however as pointed out several times it pinned them for lengthy stretches and going wide could have exposed us to counter attacks.

The real problem with battering at canes was the lack of consistency in reffing, canes got away with repeated murder in the 5 yard zone. Perhaps recognizing this Force could have chanced their luck and changed tack...we will never know the outcome

I was happy they COULD and DID give it to tbe canes as they did instead of bending over and taking it up the khyber

More excuse's, will there be a loss this season that the ref didn't determine the outcome or will you continue to gloss over the real reason's the Force can't score tries.

I could guarantee that Wessels and the boy's aren't using the easy options