More bleating from out of England....

[Jethro]

Yes it's haka time again, must be a slow rugby news day over in Pomgolia

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/rugbyworl...he_haka_1.html

Well at least it gives them something else to talk about rather than the inept performance of the locals.

Mr Growden surely an article is long overdue, com'n easy target, let's the racism run riot, and gives the "big brother" watchers something to rant on about.

[James]

Racism how exactly? Realistically, how does the haka have anything at all to do with race?

[The EnForcer]

Interesting point of view...what really concerns me is that they let idiots like that onto planes.

[zimeric]

i think he is a little misguided but I too think that other teams should have the right to reply without "insulting" the NZ fans. They can get a bit precious when someone refuses to front up during the Haka.
on the other hand, if the english are so worried about the advantage this ceremony gives NZ then why don't they stand in a line and sing " Swing-low" or something.
The South Africans at one point had a Zulu dance, which to be honest was a little wild and meaningless as it wasnt done by the players but it sure got the attention of the AB's hehe...

[Sagerian]

I wonder what our traditional war dance would be.. Do we just get 15 pool cues and advance on them?

[Jehna]

I wonder what our traditional war dance would be.. Do we just get 15 pool cues and advance on them?

Nah I imagine we'd probably crank out the bbq's and invite them over for a snagga

[shasta]

An interesting reply to that blog..........

3. At 06:32 PM on 24 Sep 2007, Richard McClune wrote:

If the All Blacks are going to rely on the old 'It was how we traditionally challenged our enemies' line perhaps the Scots could have replied in kind. My understanding is that the Scots traditional challenge before battle was to lift their kilts and expose their wedding tackle and then their rear ends to their enemies.

Might have raised a few eyebrows. Only problem is that Jerry Collins has already done that one.

[JediKnight]

An interesting reply to that blog..........

3. At 06:32 PM on 24 Sep 2007, Richard McClune wrote:

If the All Blacks are going to rely on the old 'It was how we traditionally challenged our enemies' line perhaps the Scots could have replied in kind. My understanding is that the Scots traditional challenge before battle was to lift their kilts and expose their wedding tackle and then their rear ends to their enemies.

Might have raised a few eyebrows. Only problem is that Jerry Collins has already done that one.

That's what the supporters did when the AB's walked out on to the pitch!!! Just as well it was a balmy autumn afternoon in Edinburgh.

[Jethro]

Racism how exactly? Realistically, how does the haka have anything at all to do with race?

Mainly due to the whole "war dance" thing and the complete lack of understanding about the haka. BTW the haka was being performed by kiwi teams long before National Anthems being played at Rugger matches was introduced.

The haka is intrinsically a part of Maori culture, ergo everything to do with race and what it means to be a kiwi. May have to lob in an article re Maori culture, integration, and why we have a right to have three separate pre match things. Yay us btw.

On the Jerry Collins thing, full apology what was the Jerrinator thinking Black day for kiwi sport in more ways than one.

[Jehna]

Ah they all have their moments Jethro. Imagine what some players say that we don't hear about. Admittedly not nice but i'm sure worse has been said.

[Burgs]

The haka is intrinsically a part of Maori culture, ergo everything to do with race and what it means to be a kiwi.

Shouldn't that read "The haka is intrinsically a part of Maori culture, ergo everything to do with race and what it means to be a Maori"?
I'm tipping there is your fair share of white Kiwi's who support the haka due to its link to the All Blacks but don't "embrace" the Maori people?

[Jehna]

I'm tipping there is your fair share of white Kiwi's who support the haka due to its link to the All Blacks but don't "embrace" the Maori people?

I'm tipping there are alot of people world wide who just thinks the haka looks awesome and consequently we should keep it...if i could think of anything equally as cool for the aussie's to do i'd let them...but i can't...thus i don't care that we don't have an equivalent. I'm happy to let the kiwi's jump up and down and scream at us...i'm not sure it is quite as scary and intimidating as its cracked up to be

[James]

Mainly due to the whole "war dance" thing and the complete lack of understanding about the haka. BTW the haka was being performed by kiwi teams long before National Anthems being played at Rugger matches was introduced.

The haka is intrinsically a part of Maori culture, ergo everything to do with race and what it means to be a kiwi. May have to lob in an article re Maori culture, integration, and why we have a right to have three separate pre match things. Yay us btw.

Personally I don't really care at all whether the haka is on or not, if its on fine if its not thats also cool but I think it's wrong to brand their views racist. To take the Wales match last year as a good example, why shouldn't Wales be allowed to reply with the playing of their national anthem? To me that is one group (Maori/Kiwis/New Zealanders) having preferential treatment to another group (the Welsh). Feel free to disagree but that smarts of racism to me more than saying that misunderstanding the haka is racist. As you will well know the end result of the Wales/NZ dispute was that NZ refused to do the haka publicly if it were to be followed up by the Welsh national anthem. It was childish if you ask me, New Zealand were bound to win and they were guests in Wales- would it have done any harm to allow them to play it?

Hypothetically if the Wallabies wanted to sing Waltzing-Matilda in reply to the haka would that be fair to you? One nation matching a cultural icon of their's to the other? Yet were that the case do you honestly believe New Zealanders would accept that.

[Jethro]

Shouldn't that read "The haka is intrinsically a part of Maori culture, ergo everything to do with race and what it means to be a Maori"?
I'm tipping there is your fair share of white Kiwi's who support the haka due to its link to the All Blacks but don't "embrace" the Maori people?

Incorrect, if brought up in kiwiland you are well aware of Maori culture. There's a lot more integration and acceptance of our indigenous culture in New Zealand than what the kooris receive in Australia.

James ever been to a Bledisloe in Sydney? Matilda gets belted out straight after the haka, and it's actually quite an expierance to hear 80k Sydney Siders in full voice. More of this stuff would be good for the game. The Scots, Welsh, and French have it all over us when it comes to building atmosphere ... you simply don't get this from any other sport with the possible exception of soccer (football for the Euros).

As to the Welsh thing, mind games comes to mind or storm in a teacup. Kiwis can be slightly precious on occasion.

Having played in New Zealand you do face a few teams that will lay down a haka, there's more than one, pre match. Trick is to face up to it, and then try and score first. End of day pretty awesome expierance to be on the receiving end of one.

Good fishing trip by the BBC blogger btw.

[James]

I haven't been to a bledisloe cup match in Sydney, no, my apologies for the bad example. I respect the fact the haka is good for atmosphere and that a lot of fans love it. I don't think it comes down to racism though it seems a bit harsh to me. As you say I suppose you can't blame the home unions trying to advert the pressure on them from their lousy performances.