2013 STATE SCHOOL BOYS TOUR SQUAD

[James]

I agree that this is a factor but since I can remember, WA has always been competitive regardless. In the days of DIV II, WA would usually make up nearly half of the Combined states team which made the finals one year. Since the promotion to Div I, WA have done okay and always beaten ACT or VIC and had multiple reps in the Aus teams... this year, no wins, one rep in Aus A.... Is it because we have no talent at this age? I doubt it. I personally lay the blame at the coaches feet.... but then again that is my opinion..

Two years ago we did really well with 1 in the the Australia squad and four or five in the Australia 'A's but last year was a bad year and I think we only had one (or maybe none?).

[DinkyDi]

The squad played tune up games against a few local U20's sides and put the cleaners through them. I also watched quite a few of their training sessions and the preparation from that perspective was solid. Quite a few of their players were dogged with injury in the lead up and were under done, not an excuse, just fact. I am also lead to believe that a few of the so called big guns under performed on tour and failed to step up to the next level. Its easy to paste the coaches, players should also be held accountable. This group has quite a few egos, fingers crossed this tour has brought them back to earth.

Fair call and frankly a worrying sign seen at all age group levels - kids being told that and believing they are better than they are, kids having superb natural talent until they have to fight for the win, kids believing that they are bigger than the team. It is a very common thread. The number of age group lads I see in Aus that are hot with ball in hand but you turn them around and its almost as if they say " what, me chase back - isn't that someone else's problem".

What can be done? I would be interested in other opinions on this.

Re the coaching - It is just an observation that when coaches of the past (bloke from Wests springs to mind) there seemed to be more success. Elwee has had almost none at any level barring the year he flew in the Hawkes Bay ITM team under the guise of Wanneroo. Schoolboys is a massive commitment to coach as is any rep team but all I am saying is that it may be time to look at some fresh blood considering the past couple of years results.

[PeterM]

I believe it comes down to attitude and instilling the right attitude in all players and the required commitment at the earliest level of rugby possible.

One of the biggest hindrances to any coach or manager in my view is parents who believe their son is a superstar and being told they can walk on water. Players need a reality check and to be told what they are good at but more importantly what they need to work on to become an even more complete player.

I am strongly considering putting myself through a couple of the Rugby WA beginning coaching courses and a referring course so I can try my hand at coaching one of the Under 10's team at my sons club next season.

[Pacman]

Any truth to the rumour that at least one Force Academy player in that age group did not make it into the Schoolboys Squad?

If so, what is he / they doing in the Academy?

I think Tom McCrone is the missing academy player from the squad.

From what I've been told by people in attendance, Tommy McCrone was needed over there for his great communication skills, leadership and getting the boys up when the chips are down in those tight games that did occur.

Oh well, hindsight's a wonderful thing aye Elwee and Nestor.

[DinkyDi]

You do have to put this all in perspective re selection for Aus Schools - all of the selectors are affiliated to Eastern States Schools and as such have a vested interest in ensuring that the correct quota of players from Joeys, Southport, Kings, Nudgee etc etc make the cut. It is terribly difficult for an "outsider" to make it as there is a serious fight for school supremacy and braging rights involved.

If you look at the teams ( http://austschools.rugbynet.com.au/d....asp?id=202000 ) you can see that there are three or four from the ACT, one from WA (well done that lad) and the rest from Qld and NSW. Is this a true reflection of the individual talent on show - I doubt it. However, not winning a single game signifies something different.

[zed]

You do have to put this all in perspective re selection for Aus Schools - all of the selectors are affiliated to Eastern States Schools and as such have a vested interest in ensuring that the correct quota of players from Joeys, Southport, Kings, Nudgee etc etc make the cut. It is terribly difficult for an "outsider" to make it as there is a serious fight for school supremacy and braging rights involved.

If you look at the teams ( http://austschools.rugbynet.com.au/d....asp?id=202000 ) you can see that there are three or four from the ACT, one from WA (well done that lad) and the rest from Qld and NSW. Is this a true reflection of the individual talent on show - I doubt it. However, not winning a single game signifies something different.

I wouldn't necessarily start blaming the coach for the teams performance. They're playing in a pretty competitive division now and our player base is minute compared to that of NSW & Queensland. And a lot of those players from Qld & NSW will go on to play professional rugby and even international rugby. Guys like Tepai Moeroa & Taane Milne have already been picked up NRL clubs. WA is an AFL state. We are never going to be in a position to challenge NSW or QLD.

[DinkyDi]

I wouldn't necessarily start blaming the coach for the teams performance. They're playing in a pretty competitive division now and our player base is minute compared to that of NSW & Queensland. And a lot of those players from Qld & NSW will go on to play professional rugby and even international rugby. Guys like Tepai Moeroa & Taane Milne have already been picked up NRL clubs. WA is an AFL state. We are never going to be in a position to challenge NSW or QLD.

Being competitive against Qld and NSW is possible... beating them is more difficult I agree. I was not there so cannot comment on individual performances and frankly dont want too but reading the reports (probably biased to our Eastern States brethren) it seems that the fundamentals were lacking in some games. The games we should be winning are V the ACT and Vic. There are no excuses here... same sized talent pool, same Super Rugby background and same time frame together. I am sure that there are reasons for the lack of results but it does not help when the head coach has a history of poor performances at numerous levels.

Again - this is just my opinion and as mentioned, I am sure that there are other factors to take into account though I think that this is the first year we have not won a game...

[lenanorm]

NSW will be a tough game.

It was a tough game but wouldnt u want to put yr strongest team forward to take on the number one team in aussie coaching staff including nestor had syked the boys out before they even left wa saying to them after that they we never gonna
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[lenanorm]

Win that game so opting to leave all the number 1 players on the bench....i dont understand that sort of coaching if there is a logic reason for doing that id love to hear why they would of opted to do that none of the players were injured.....
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[lenanorm]

From what I've been told by people in attendance, Tommy McCrone was needed over there for his great communication skills, leadership and getting the boys up when the chips are down in those tight games that did occur.

Oh well, hindsight's a wonderful thing aye Elwee and Nestor.

That was a big shock not to see him go with the team.....
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[lenanorm]

Fair call and frankly a worrying sign seen at all age group levels - kids being told that and believing they are better than they are, kids having superb natural talent until they have to fight for the win, kids believing that they are bigger than the team. It is a very common thread. The number of age group lads I see in Aus that are hot with ball in hand but you turn them around and its almost as if they say " what, me chase back - isn't that someone else's problem".

What can be done? I would be interested in other opinions on this.

Re the coaching - It is just an observation that when coaches of the past (bloke from Wests springs to mind) there seemed to be more success. Elwee has had almost none at any level barring the year he flew in the Hawkes Bay ITM team under the guise of Wanneroo. Schoolboys is a massive commitment to coach as is any rep team but all I am saying is that it may be time to look at some fresh blood considering the past couple of years results.

I like yr comment about the coaching i think it has a lot to do with respect as well Grace has that with people in general as a teacher he knows how to earn that respect as well as demand it and it shows from his success yesterday with his team Taking out the schools tournament in the gold coast..... i am a parent of one of the boys in the state team i dont consider myself to be bias as far as im aware ...but watching the boys play the uni team mondae before flying out was such a positive sign for them to do awesum on their trip and the guys spirits were all on a high until the last training run when u had nestor and elwee argueing in front of the boys for more then 5 mins about what they were going to wear for the travell....and then naming the team to play mondae with everyone not just the players that were benched with their heads down now thats not agood sight for parents to see after being on a high for the whole week and the bang shattered before leaving......i am utterly disgusted in what comes next during the course of the trip....the coaches but mainly nestors abusive verbal cursing at the boys after their games and away from their parents at their individual game reviews... now this aint just the one game its every game review this information didnt even come from.my son (yes i am a parent i would like to share this information so people can get an idea as to what our boys are going thru and have beem going thru for the past couple of state trips this isnt just happening with the 18s bit also the younger age groups that nestor is invloved with) some might say im not a fan of nestor and u would be right...blake phillips wasnt even in the academy this year so there is definately no pat on the back for nestor.....its a joke we need people in these positions who want to develop our boys have a positive outlook on things have interesting options of play, lets them play with the skill that they were born with and not try and limit their talent...
And Grace is the man
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[Pacman]

I see Mr Nestor was sitting in the coaches box directly to Foleys left on Saturday. Good on him - he is the Force 'A' coach after all.

Interesting times ahead for the Academy.
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[NTTCK]

Wow

There has been a lot of negative and positive feedback from everyone. But if anyone would know better, until you were there to see it for yourself. You would know exactly what you were talking about. I know, because I was there.

I am not here to say that it was this persons fault or that. But know that my son missed out on being selected due to decision making made by both my son and the coaching staff.

Now unfortunately for my son, he now has to work a little harder to get the dream any of our young players want to be, whether it is to play for Australia or another country... My son is now to old to represent the State in rugby here in Perth...
I am now deciding on sending him back home to NZ, where rugby is so different and there's a lot more opportunity for him there or if not to the Eastern States...
Because, realistically what is there for these boys after U18s School Boys???? Nothing.. 20s and Prems????

I was saddened to hear my son tell me the reason to why he hadn't been selected after selectors spoke to him and it was because he didn't attack enough. Why??? I still ask myself this question..... From my own sons mouth, it was because the game plan was to defend.... Now my question is.... When do we actually attack to get tries, to get points on the board, considering the scores were:

NSW - 68 - 8 Loss
Queensland - 33 - 17 Loss
Combined States - 30 -26 Loss
And then playing ACT for 7th and 8th place - 8 - 6 Loss

I am not going to tell you the strategies of why the scores were what they are... But in my eyes all the boys who took the fields that entire week ... Didn't matter what club they play for here in Perth are all great potential, intelligent, strong, amazing and most humblest players I know...

Their talents were hidden, unjustified and damn right disappointing to see our young WA talent go unseen and unspoken for, when I know and I'm sure a lot of you know, they all have what it takes to make Professional rugby players.

My heart was saddened to see their moral, their entire bodies battered over situations which could of and should of been avoided. I am a strong believer in finding the inner being of a person, no matter what and I love helping out those that have no hope or have lost confidence in their own abilities. Especially when you can see they have so much to give...

Today, I am still sad for a lot of them... I don't really know a lot of the new players...
But Hayden, Hershelle, Gus, Tim, Terrell, Mike Tui, Jayden, Jacob were potential School Boys Material...

Unfortunately for some of these boys its over.... Others have the opportunity to make it again... And I hope and pray they do all they can to make their debut next year....

Seriously changes need to be made.. Preparation has to be done way well in advance if we are ever to become a winning State again.. And Respect and Attitudes need to change and come from both Management and Players.... A New Coaching team needs to come on board too...

[NTTCK]

Oh & lets not forget...
Congrats to BLAKE PHILLIPS for making the Australian School Boys A's... Good on you boy!!!! Proud of you...
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[dart]

this boy blake phillips why isnt he in the academy